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Podcast ยป Brian Russon-How the Pandemic Changed the Cultural and Accelerated Virtuality Adoption
Brian Russon on How the Pandemic Changed the Cultural and Accelerated Virtuality Adoption | Business Transformation Podcast [005]
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"Enhancing the patient journey is at the core of our mission! ๐ Excited to share insights from Brian Russon on leveraging technology for accessible healthcare." #PatientJourney #HealthTech #BusinessTransformation"
Heath Gascoigne Tweet
Get ready for an insightful dive into the world of virtual healthcare with our guest, Brian Russon, CEO, and co-founder of Patient Genie! ๐ผ๐ฅ
Patient Genie is revolutionizing healthcare accessibility through their TeleHealth platform, prioritizing security and consumer engagement.
In this episode, Brian shares his expertise in healthcare, product marketing, and management, shedding light on the importance of virtualization in the current healthcare landscape.
๐ก With a focus on people, process, and technology, Brian discusses how Patient Genie is bridging the gap between consumers and healthcare providers, especially in these challenging times.
Tune in as Brian reveals strategic insights and tips for managing a successful healthcare business in the digital age! ๐ง
#HealthcareInnovation #VirtualHealthcare #BusinessTransformationPodcast
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Transcript
Heath: Okay, Brian. So, at the moment, my guys who usually looks into this is about they build the transformation and implement it but they think of the value that you have is that you are either engaged at the customer need, the customer facing of them actually engaging with the final solution. Have you seen the needs or the technology change or what are some of the changes that are happening recently? Are those needs being met by the technology?
Brian: I think weโre getting there. I think weโll continue to see kind of adoption of virtualization in a multitude of different sectors, health care being one of those sectors, as we continue to migrate as a populace from brick and mortar into more virtual settings. I think the events with COVID and the pandemic kind of force fed that to a lot of people, forced adoption that we hadnโt really anticipated for, you know, at least a few more years and expedited both scale of tele companies, whether that be organizations like Zoom or Teladoc or other kind of tele or virtual health type companies and tele companies. I think weโll continue to see kind of iteration and growth and scale as people demand that more so with traditional brick and mortar settings.
Heath: I remember when, soon after the pandemic started, Zoom was becoming very popular but also โ what was it called? Like the prank Zoomers who would join in on other peopleโs calls and then thereโd be instances of indecent exposure, if thatโs the word. Yeah. Some things I think Zoom caught on really quick that their security wasnโt up to scratch with the rush to get these solutions out. Thereโs a case there that maybe they missed a couple of checks and boxes along the way. What are you finding that everyone is in a hurry but theyโre not doing the quality assurance?
Brian: Yeah, I mean, we all kinda, you know, went straight into the fire, if you will, at that point. You know, fortunately, we built kind of a telehealth system, security and privacy were kind of paramount, you know, way before we were ever needed to scale and so we built, and I think the industry as a whole really built around that kind of premise in telehealth specific for kinda health care privacy initiatives and rules and regulations. So we were in a much better position relative to privacy and security than some other companies that were more just focused on kind of video conferencing, if you will, that was really just kind of point-to-point connectivity. We benefited from being in the industry that we were in at that point in time. It has been good to see kind of iterations and growth as those organizations have had to painfully scale over the last couple of years.
Heath: Yeah, okay. So, yeah, usually, personally, my experience has been with this digital transformation is that itโs technology-led change and then theyโll make, or maybe towards the end of their development and build and design, their implementation, then theyโll check with the user and go, โOkay, is it good enough for you?โ And most of the time, the businesses kinda go, โItโs not really good enough but weโll let them finish what theyโre doing and then weโll find a workaround.โ Then, what Iโve found is, although the technology guys are interested in building their tech, the things like that security part wasnโt front and center. It is like, โLetโs do that last.โ But you just happened to be โ that was your first thing you did. Well done.
Brian: Yeah, we were in a highly secure, highly privatized or private-centric industry with health care and so we were well positioned at that point in time to build appropriately for what we, you know, had no idea was coming downstream.
Heath: Yeah, lucky you. So, have you seen what is the particular users or demographics that are, well, first, letโs say a first adopter or they are the laggards, maybe itโs the elder generation who may actually be in more need of these services but because of technology, with, say, resistance to change. What have you found?
Brian: I think initially with telehealth and then Iโll kinda come forward to where weโre at with Patient Genie and some of the strategy we have around Patient Genie. You know, with telehealth, it was really early adopters, but you would kind of expect early adopters, technologists, folks that, you know, are used to kind of virtual communication, et cetera. And then COVID hit and it was just kind of the skyโs the limit. It was everyone, right? It was moms with kids at home, it was anyone who didnโt wanna go to the doctorโs office, you know, all the major clinics were closed, you had to connect via telehealth so we were kinda force fed into a virtual world. That led itself into the entire populace being a lot more comfortable with virtuality.
Heath: Yeah.
Brian: And I think, as we look at what weโre doing with Patient Genie around really kind of expanding the capability for a consumer to own that kind of virtual experience with a provider, both in how they search for a provider, how they find providers, how they engage with providers, having that be more of a virtual experience all the way around is something that we โ a lesson that we took from that experience. We look at the demographics now as we look at key markets, you know, 18- to 24-year-olds get 60 percent of their health information from social networks or social environments. Thatโs a big capture when you start looking at misinformation and real information, clinical information that isnโt getting exposed in those networks, you know, environments.
Heath: Okay, so your platform finds a way or has a method and means to get around that or to give them that information that they need?
Brian: Yeah. I mean, weโre building a digital kind of multichannel marketing platform that allows health care professionals, whether that be, you know, MD, DO, NPs, et cetera, RNs, a better way to engage with consumers and I use the term โconsumersโ purposefully where consumers are looking for health information, whether that be, โI moved to a new region and I need to find a doctor,โ or, โIโve just got diagnosed with a new condition and I donโt know anything about it, I wanna find out more,โ or, you know, even as simple as, โIโm at home, Iโve got a headache, I donโt wanna go to the doctor but I want more information. I wanna make sure Iโm getting real information, not misinformation.โ
Heath: Okay, so your platform is a replacement of face-to-face meetings with a practitioner.
Brian: It can be. Weโre not necessarily tied into one vehicle of communication. We will enable both telehealth as well as traditional brick and mortar settings from an engagement and scheduling perspective. So itโs really more about kind of, if you will, kind of the Tinder of health care, right? Of really taking a consumer thatโs looking for a service and matching that consumer with the right provider providing that service, regardless of the delivery of care.
Heath: Okay. All right. Actually, thereโs, in the digital health space and a couple of guys that weโve had on, they talked about how different technologies are here now and wearables and different types of sensors for heart rate, blood pressure, you see a demand in that or change in demand in that?
Brian: Yeah, we continue to see demand in that. I spent a number of years at Microsoft a decade or so ago working on HealthVault, which was their consumer health platform. We were doing devices and device connectivity then. We saw early adopters around, you know, the typical usual suspects that you would see adopting that tech. I think weโll continue to see growth there. The RPM and home health initiatives that continue to kind of proliferate the market, I think people, as a general rule, are becoming more technologically advanced and savvy with those techs. And, you know, I mean, Iโm a big data guy so the more data that you can kind of extrapolate in a non-invasive way, the better. And then, you know, you can build the algorithms, you can build the expertise to manage that data and engage people at the point at which they need to be engaged.
Heath: Okay, so youโre โ thereโs a thing about organizations having the capability and then some organizations, they might call a capability technology, and other organizations, theyโll call that technical capability, business capability, which includes people process and technology. So, are you seeing that organizations, B2B, that they are looking to get a solution, a technology solution off the shelf or theyโre actually looking to build this capability where they can own, manage it, and improve it?
Brian: I think it depends on this strategic imperative of the organization themselves. There are some that prefer to build and keep it within their four walls. I think thereโs others that are more partner centric, or, you know, market centric, where they know that they can build some things in house but sometimes that expertise just doesnโt exist in house and needs to be done outside of their four walls. You know, I tend to lean on the latter. Iโm a partner centric kind of guy. Thatโs the world I come from and I think thereโs really great products in their niches, in their swim lanes, especially in health care, because itโs such a big space. Really great niche products there that just maybe miss some concatenation with other really great products that really could kind of bend the curves that weโre all trying to bend.
Heath: All right. Do you get involved in the business transformation in the early parts and dealing with organization? Do you look like a typical clinic or a clinic that has many offices or outlets and then theyโll call you in? How does a normal engagement work for you?
Brian: Yeah, I mean, we typically work, because weโre at the front end of that kind of consumer engagement side of an organization, weโll typically work with some business transformation, mostly around tweaking how their advertising dollars are spent to make sure that theyโre, you know, not only building brand, which is the core of health care advertising today, but also kind of meeting consumers where the demand is, right? Whether that be around capacity management or knowledge transfer or engagement as a general rule, those are areas where we really focus and work with our customers and prospective customers around how do they engage those consumers at that point that theyโre looking for care and theyโre looking for engagement? How do they do that in a meaningful way as opposed to becoming overbearing or just a brand play?
Heath: Okay, it is a good point you mentioned there about engagement and the world Iโm used to with, they call them user journeys or user experience, trying to understand what that user journey is across the organization and then trying to anticipate what their pain points are and how can you improve it. For you, in this industry, for you, mostly common, everyone experiences pretty much the same thing?
Brian: Yeah, I mean, localization might be a little bit different but we kinda call it the patient journey, right? The existing patient journey where, โIโm Brian, I just got diagnosed with something, I want more info about it.: And, today, that process is I go to Google or I go to Bing and I search for that condition. It brings back a bunch of results from WebMD and Healthline and content providers and I can read about it. But then when I wanna actually do something, I canโt do anything. And so Iโve gotta then take that onus on me, I gotta go to my social networks and say, โHey, does anybody else have this? Anybody have any experience? And does anybody know a doctor that treats this, et cetera?โ And then, you know, at least in the US, youโve gotta go back and find out is that doctor in your network? Can you even go see that provider? And if you can, then you have to go to the health systemโs website to see if thereโs capacity for that doctor to see you. And if thereโs not, or if any one of those things falls apart, you start over. So itโs a completely inefficient consumer experience โ
Heath: Yep, yep.
Brian: โ how we consume health care. Completely different than how we consume any other consumable product. And so what weโre trying to do is improve that patient journey so that itโs a less inefficient pathway.
Heath: Okay, so this is almost like a disruption,
Brian: Maybe a little bit of a parallel disruption to health care in general
Heath: Iโve lived some time in Australia, 14 years, and the way health care works there is if you have an issue or you wanna see a physio, you go straight to the physio, and you donโt need to go to a doctor to get a referral. Over here, in the UK, if you wanna go see a physio, youโve gotta go see a doctor to get a referral. And really, itโs just a meet and greet for the doctor whoโs going to say, โWhat do you wanna do?โ and then you go see this guy. But itโs like, well, Iโm in a bit of pain, and I go see someone about it, itโs like theyโve added an extra step. So, what did you do that for? You know? Someone clearly wasnโt thinking about the user experience for that one.
Brian: I think at the end of the day, all those providers wanna do is provide care to the individuals that are looking for care โ
Heath: Yeah.
Brian: โ and consumers are just looking for somebody to say, โHey, yep, your back hurts, let me help you fix that,โ and weโve created a bunch of inefficiencies just because of how the systems work. Thereโs a better way to get through those inefficiencies than the current modus.
Heath: So you find โ so two things here. Whatโs the process that you follow when you approach maybe a client, they know that their systems are inefficient or theyโre mainly brick and mortar, and they go, you know, โLook, weโve gotta move online. This is inefficient for us. We canโt handle the capacity. Weโve got queues out the door, weโre turning people away.โ Do you have a process that you go through engaging them, understanding what their problems are, what a particular solution looks like?
Brian: Yeah, I mean, it really depends on the organization. At this point, most organizations have a virtual front door. They have a virtual offering, because kind of COVID put that โ forced everyone into it. And so now itโs around that balance, striking that balance between their kind of traditional brick and mortar strategy and their virtual health strategy and making sure that theyโre capturing the patients that are looking for care at that point in time. And so for us, we tend to lean on the analytical side of that and saying, โHey, hereโs what we know exists in the consumer world. Hereโs the searches that we see, hereโs the localization that we see.โ You know, if, letโs say, a large health system brings in a new orthopedist, you know, they obviously are coming in with maybe a very small set of patients already or maybe they got some overflow capacity thatโs gonna go to that orthopedist. But outside of, you know, kind of traditional marketing, thereโs really no way for that market to understand thereโs a new orthopedist in town. And, you know, we have consumers that we know are searching for orthopedists on one side of the equation, we have the analytics to then go back and look at that and say, โHey, look, you know, we can help navigate those individuals that are looking for an orthopedist to this capacity opening that weโve got at one of our health system clients.โ
Heath: Okay, so you use data-driven decision making or insight to make your suggestions or recommendation?
Brian: Yeah. So back to that analogy of, you know, the Tinder of health care, we use, you know, both the data around capacity management, we also use data around quality rankings, we use data around sheer volume throughput, because all thatโs public data here, you know? We know how many procedures or providers of any kind of knee replacements, for example, right? So if Iโm in Austin, Texas, I can say, โLook, I wanna see you the provider thatโs done the most knee replacements in Austin, Texas, that has my insurance, that speaks Spanish, and has a capacity opening,โ right? And so we can take all those data points, we can develop the algorithm that allows us to be the best match. They create that best match for that consumer thatโs looking for that orthopedist.
Heath: Okay, so you focus solely at the moment on the US?
Brian: Yeah, primarily focused on the US right now because, in our perspective, the problem we understand well here. Weโve built telehealth globally in a past life, you know? We understand the US health care problems. I mean, there is obviously global applicability to what weโre building here but the nuances of the different systems, the way they work in different countries, creates a little bit of a lift for us as we look at global expansion. So, initially, weโll focus on the US market.
Heath: Okay. And so the โ like, maybe Japan, for example, has a different type of demographic so thereโs different criteria, different needs, different concerns that need to be addressed, and also a language issue so that wouldnโt be one of the immediate next locations to go and tap into.
Brian: We have a strategy, for sure, when we look at globalization. And if one of those areas or regions kind of bubble to the top faster than others, either due to investment or due to kind of need, then, you know, weโll make it a necessary pivot.
Heath: Okay. You know, most of these change and transformation programs, one of the things thatโs often missed is people and culture. They focus on process or technology. And what youโre saying earlier is, due to the pandemic, that there was this now atmosphere of maybe change, where we force change so now people have that heightened awareness of needing to change, maybe their behaviors are now changing then so how have you found that for you? This has been a major positive for you orโฆ?
Brian: Yeah, it continues to be a positive. I think, culturally, both here in the States and globally, I think all of us have somewhat of a demand now that we kind of have an expectation and a demand that things will get delivered in a virtual world, right? We do that with, you know, food delivery businesses, we do that with education now where, you know, if the kids are sick, well, theyโll just Zoom in, right?
Heath: Yeah, yeah.
Brian: And we see that in health care as well. So I think if any one good thing came out of that kind of forced environment over the course of the last couple years, itโs that the culture globally has really gotten to a point where theyโve said, โHey, weโre gonna lean on technology either out of convenience or out of requirement.โ
Heath: Yep, okay. Have you seen, out of that, the early adopters, maybe the laggards, but youโre gonna get some people that just wonโt, for whatever reason, trust technology, trust the data, what can you do with that?
Brian: Thatโs okay, right? I mean, health care, as I mentioned before, is a touch and feel brick and mortar business and weโre not trying to replace that. Thatโll always exist. And so what we are gonna capitalize on, what we are gonna capture, are the individuals that are saying, โHey, Iโm okay doing this virtually,โ right? I wouldnโt want to have a knee replacement done virtually, right.
Heath: Yeah.
Brian: But I am okay, you know, doing a cold or a flu or a COVID check or, you know, even a routine visit that doesnโt require touch and feel necessarily, Iโm okay with that. And I think, to your point, as we look at biometric devices and kind of the continual growth and innovation in that space, that data becomes a lot more rich, it becomes a lot more trustworthy for providers, and I think we will continue to see alternative business models to the brick and mortar setting that may capitalize or utilize that a lot more so.
Heath: Yes, thatโs what I was actually gonna say, that business model earlier, is that those brick and mortar organizations are effectively, if theyโre moving on or making a part of their offering digital or a digital front office, I think the word somebody used, that is changing your business model.
Brian: Yeah, and I would say that those organizations, those traditional kind of health systems, health provider organizations, that are adopting those strategies, itโs not a replacement strategy, right? I donโt see the hospital closing their doors and saying, โHey, weโre not gonna provide bed care anymore, weโre just gonna be all virtual.โ We may see virtual-only hospitals but thatโs not realistic, right? There will always be people that need to be at hospital and the care and the touching care of a physician, et cetera. What weโre trying to do is say, โHey, what are the procedures? What are the activities that exist in that environment that donโt necessarily need to be brick and mortar for people that donโt want it to be brick and mortar,โ you know? To help virtualize those types of activities, whether thatโs through telehealth or social media or other capture programs where we can take the expertise, that knowledge transfer that exists in the health care sector and move that downstream to the consumer in a better and more meaningful way.
Heath: Okay, yeah, so itโs a big thing like in these transformation programs around knowledge transfer, is a big thing. Usually, itโd be the consultants that will come in, work through the project or transformation with the client, and then the consultants would leave with the knowledge.
Brian: Correct.
Heath: Yeah, and the organization would go, โOh, we have to bring the guys back again,โ because theyโve got the knowledge and none of this knowledge transfer that they talk about actually happens in reality.
Brian: Right.
Heath: Yea. So, are you seeing โ whatโs a major โ the organization and the market, the industry has changed from the brick and mortar, have gone hybrid, theyโve got some elements now of digitalization. Whereโs it going? Whatโs next?
Brian: Thatโs a good question, you know? I wish I had that crystal ball because Iโd start building for the crystal ball. But I would say weโre still, like I mentioned before, weโre still very fledgling when it comes to virtualization in health care. Still a lot of lift there. Thereโs a lot of industry there. I think that the health systems of the future will be a strong hybrid that have some capabilities in a virtual environment and obviously have capability in a brick and mortar environment and then what that looks like in 5 or 10 years from now, Iโm not really sure.
Heath: Okay, yeah, I could see your business, your platform being very useful over here in the UK, because of the inefficiencies that they have here, even though the private health sector do have, and Iโve had myself the virtual meetings, but it has been almost a hit and miss trying to get on a call with a specialist or practitioner. Thereโs a particular type of injury, I fractured my ankle snowboarding and needed to get treatment from there and then getting passed around, these guys donโt really know about the fibula, they know about every other bone but not exactly the fibula so, you know, this is โ do I actually have to walk into this hospital myself with my broken leg?
Brian: Right. Well, I think that goes back to the big data kind of component, right? Being able to look at providers, as youโre analyzing a provider to see being able to look at the data and say, hey, look, you know, this provider has done 5,000 ankle surgeries, right? At that point, they really know the ankle inside and out, thatโs the guy I wanna talk to, as opposed to maybe a generalist that maybe doesnโt have that same level of tenure given the condition that youโre looking for. So, you know, when we look at matching people with the right providers, itโs really kind of a basis around the algorithmic approach of taking a look at the data, building the filters, and then, you know, allowing consumers to interact and engage with those providers based on that match.
Heath: By the criteria. Yeah, yeah. With my ankle, actually, I was in a cast, it was an open boot for 12 months. And, you know, itโs like the usual, you know, when thereโs some fraud going on in the bank and the only way they found out about the fraud because that one person that managed the fraud was away so I went into the hospital and my usual specialist was away and the other chap that I saw, he said, thatโs the first time weโve met but Iโve had a look at your record and Iโm not too sure why youโre being told what youโve been told, but we gotta put you on this over here and I want you to take home ultrasound that will strap on, next agenda was called, and then within 3 months, the thing was here. Yeah, I was like, isnโt that funny?
Brian: Health care is just like any other industry, right? Sometimes it takes a little tweak of who youโre visiting, who youโre seeing, their expertise, their background, being able to kind of, hopefully, search for that or build that criteria at the beginning saves a lot of inefficiency and a lot of, you know, wasteful spending, both on the time of the consumer as well as the provider.
Heath: Yeah, yeah, I definitely could have used your platform at that point. I would have picked the right guy from the beginning. I came back from France and then with my boot, cast, I got to London, and they said, โWhereโs your cast?โ And I said, โWell, they never gave me one in France.โ And they said, โWell, if youโre down here, youโd have to get one.โ And then they said, โHave you been walking on it?โ And I said, โNo, Iโve got boots and Iโve got my two crutches.โ And they said, โWell, itโs got bigger,โ and then thatโs where it all started.
Brian: Shouldnโt matter what country youโre in, what hospital youโre in, or what provider you see, it should be the same.
Heath: Thatโs why I couldnโt understand and I thought why would you do it differently in France versus in the UK? So, whoโs missing the trick there? Clearly missing. Yeah. I think you need to roll out that platform in Europe.
Brian: Weโre going as fast as we can.
Heath: Good, man. Good, man. So I wanna play it back to you. You talk about capability management. I think capability management in this context talks about how much the organization can handle, do you wanna manage that, now you have a data-, evidence-driven approach, you use big data algorithms to understand and maybe possibly anticipate what those trends are and then you can give hypotheses to the practitioner or for the client, the organization and then say how can you maximize the capacity, letโs say, leakage or availability that youโve got, using your data. Now, from a digital transformation projects perspective, that would be โ I see it myself with these big, big transformation programs, the projects I work on, they range from 250 million to 500 million pounds, big projects, but they mainly throw a lot of money at technology and when I talk about technology, most of the infrastructure, and then theyโll do a little bit about on the software and then, lastly, the go, actually, we never thought about security. But you saying from your perspective, you put security first.
Brian: Yes, security and privacy are paramount for us, right? This is health care. Those are not traditionally private or secure type of conversations. If youโre searching Google for a condition, right? Youโre gonna see ads, youโre gonna see โ thatโs all going to get sold back, you know, to advertisers, to pop ads and showcase, you know, those types of searches that youโre making. We took a different approach because it is health care specific. We took a different approach to that. So we donโt sell ads. Weโre not gonna allow for that to happen. Itโs a private search. If you come to our site and search for teenage pregnancy, youโre the only person thatโs gonna know that you searched for teenage pregnancy. Weโre not gonna sell that to advertisers. So I think thatโs absolutely paramount. The other thing, back to capacity kind of management, the other thing, because we own the search side, we own the search engine, we would know before any other areas would know if thereโs a region of the country or region of the world thatโs seeing disease spikes, right? So if we start seeing a lot of analytics saying, โHey, everybody in Columbia, South Carolina, is now searching for flu symptoms but abnormal flu symptoms,โ and we see a spike of that search, we could go back to the health systems in that region and say, โHey, look, weโre seeing this from a search perspective,โ way before theyโre gonna see that from a capacity management perspective. So thereโs some altruistic type activities that help us kind of see what the general populace is searching for โ
Heath: Yeah, leading indicators
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Brian: โ before they hit the system
Heath: Yeah, no, very good. So letโs say, like in the UK right now, there has been a few incidents with the track and trace system, some leaked data, so peopleโs details have been leaked. Itโs like, whoa, youโve got these multimillion dollar platforms but you canโt control the data. And this is I think that โ people are getting a little bit concerned about using these systems because, you know, itโs not secure.
Brian: Right. Yeah, thatโs the fundamental design element when we look at health care specifically is most people are private about their health care. Itโs on top of finance, itโs probably the most private interaction that you do virtually or individually. And so people wanna make sure itโs secure. They donโt want data leaks or data breaks. They wanna ensure that whatever platform theyโre using to manage their care or manage their finances are safe and secure.
Heath: Yep, okay. So your tip for them would be for the guys running these transformation programs, to not put their security data management at the end of the process but instead put it at the front of the process.
Brian: It depends. I mean, security is paramount I think in all cases but I think thereโs a handful of industries that are verticals that itโs absolutely paramount, first and foremost, you know? And I think health care and financial tech are probably two of those. Am I worried if somebody leaks that I bought 10 t-shirts last week? Iโm not too worried about that, right? If suddenly leaks that I have a disease state that I donโt really wanna share with the planet, thatโs a big deal.
Heath: Yeah, yeah, okay. All right. And you also โ you had a big thing on engagement, user journey, your version is the patient journey. I think thatโs pretty key. Iโve done a couple of UK VI, visa and immigration border force programs and they talk about the digital customer journey or the passenger journey, coming from inland, approaching the border, passing the border, crossing the border, and onto the other side when they land on the site and thatโs a big deal. And, equally, I would say for the health care, for the patient journey.
Brian: Yeah, the pain points that we explain as part of that patient journey everyone resonates with, right? We donโt have a hard time explaining the problem that weโre trying to solve with Patient Genie. Everyone gets it, everyone understands it, everybodyโs been through it. Building a richer, more efficient patient journey is the difficult task weโve chartered ourselves with.
Heath: Okay, so just from the little liberal that Iโve learned in this conversation on the benefits of Patient Genie has to offer and the size of the market that youโve got in the US, like in the US, what have you got? 340 million people?
Brian: Give or take.
Heath: Weโve got over here 60 million people and so, you know, you laugh at that. Thatโs so tiny.
Brian: Weโve got some left. Weโve got some left.
Heath: Yeah, yeah. Actually, I would love to get over to there actually. I have been there a few times. As we said before I hit the record button a little bit late. I love the US, I particularly love the snowboarding there. You guys have so much space. And so Iโve never seen so much space. Compared to Italy, been to Italy a couple of times and those places are so narrow and steep, Iโve accidentally collided with a skier who just happened to be standing at the end of the train path, I was like, โWhat are you doing standing at the end of the train path?โ And Iโve never seen a lady scream that much in all my life, even then when I skied off. Yeah, crazy. But, yeah, the US, I would love to get to the US. So, you have a process you follow, youโre very fortunate about the world culture whoโs embracing this change so like thatโs just amazing. Yeah, thatโs helped the inertia or โ we were talking change management, about the reluctance to change or thereโs too much change and people just go, โThereโs too much change, donโt do anything,โ you know?
Brian: Right. Yeah, and we have some positive momentum going around virtualization, not just in health care, but, you know, kind of the entire planet relative to tech and industry as a whole, right? We see that in every industry, just that kind of virtualization and technological advancements. So, to be at a point where weโre beginning and making a contributing part of that is exciting. So we wanna capitalize on that momentum.
Heath: Yeah, I think, yeah, youโve got probably the background, you have the platform, the timing is right, I think the question would be not so much on โ the topic would be whoโs your competitors?
Brian: Yeah, good question. I donโt know if we have any direct line, what I would deem as direct line competitors. Thereโs a lot of great companies that have built great products that do a lot of the same kind of pieces that we do.
Heath: Yeah, yeah.
Brian: I donโt think thereโs anyone right now thatโs really concatenated that into, you know, what weโre doing and really kind of reined all those in, you know? And as I mentioned before, as a partner-led organization, you know, with that as a strategy, we know weโre not gonna build everything. We know weโre gonna require, you know, really strong partners in their specific swim lanes and niches which they know better than we ever will. But being able to concatenate those strategies and those best-in-class products into one consumer experience is really what weโre focused on.
Heath: Okay, so thatโs a good takeaway there for the listeners about bringing in the required experts instead of, you know, you got your four options, buy, build, and borrow, and most of the time, people go, โI wanna build it. I wanna build it and I wanna build it myself and I wanna own it.โ And then how long does it take? Forever. And then it doesnโt โ
Brian: And by then the marketโs done.
Heath: Exactly, yeah. Yeah. Thereโs been a couple of projects Iโve been called into to help fix and rescue and theyโve tried that. Theyโre gonna build everything. So, how did that work last time? Yeah, no good. And you wanna do it the same way? Do you think itโs gonna โ you know, what do they call it? Definition of insanity?
Brian: Right.
Heath: Yeah.
Brian: Yeah. So weโll capitalize, you know, weโre a rising tide lifts all ships mentality organization, you know? Thereโs some great products out there and weโll build those relationships and weโll do it together. Itโs a big enough space. Thereโs plenty of room.
Heath: Yeah, yeah, okay. So, the trajectory for Patient Genie, while we were talking, thereโs gonna be a founderโs exit or are you gonna list it?
Brian: Good question, you know? At this point, we would probably look at an exit once we get the strategy a little bit bigger because itโs gonna have to scale and outside of doing a big raise or a big public raise like that, we would probably lean on somebody to scale it. But if we donโt find the right partner, if we donโt find the right deal, then, you know, weโre not opposed to taking it public if we need to to get to the scale point that we need to.
Heath: Okay, good stuff. Iโll be watching with great anticipation. Now, I think thatโs every entrepreneurโs, I donโt know, the dream is to take your idea from the kitchen table and then to ultimately list your company, your startup.
Brian: It probably is a dream. I mean, thereโs some, you know, excitement around that. But I think, for us, weโre more focused on the mission than we are on the exit and being able to make that a better experience, being able to make consumers more comfortable with virtual health as a general rule, if we can do that and check the box, the exit is somewhat irrelevant.
Heath: Yeah, okay. Yeah, I like that. I was asked too about my business and HOBA, whatโs the exit strategy? What do you mean? Iโm enjoying what Iโm doing, Iโm enjoying helping others. If I didnโt start this, the pain that Iโve gone through and the highs and the lows just to have someone tap me on the shoulder and say, โHey, weโll take over for now.โ So what are you talking about?
Brian: Thatโs not a bad approach either. But, you know, weโre pretty early stage still. We got a long road before we get to those conversations.
Heath: Yeah, yeah. Well, Iโll be watching. Iโll be watching because Iโm coming over to the States. Finally, Iโll get a lot of that โ half the book sales sell in the States, one to two copies a day. And then most of my โ half the traffic is from the States and I do no marketing or anything so, yeah, that 340 million population, I think Iโve gotta get over, you know?
Brian: Organic growth is the best growth.
Heath: Yeah, yeah, plus you got the best ski fields in the world so Iโm really keen. Yeah, if I could this season, I will, but if I canโt get to Europe, then itโs like, you know what? Iโm coming over to Utah, Salt Lake, get on the mountain with you.
Brian: Best powder on the planet.
Heath: Oh, yeah. Champagne powder.
Brian: Thatโs right
Heath: First time I heard that, I was like, no, I never heard of this thing. Whatโs this about? And then we stayed in a chalet that had a little balcony. My mate just said, โWatch this,โ and he just fell face forward into the ground and into the powder and he came out laughing. Thatโs amazing. Iโve never seen in my whole life. Yeah, champagne powder. Yeah, amazing.
Brian: It is the best stuff.
Heath: Yeah. Iโm gonna bring my longboard though. Canโt be bringing my little jumper board, youโll get stuck there. Staying there and getting nowhere.
Brian: Bring that powder board.
Heath: Yeah, the 161. No problem.
Brian: Thatโs right. thatโs right.
Heath: Yeah, yeah, Iโve been there. Actually, yeah, I donโt know โ thereโs no โ there was a video up on YouTube of my riding at Woodwards but mostly it was skateboarding on a ramp. Yeah. But if you look it up, it might be there. Yeah. And Iโll look you up when I get over there.
Brian: Good stuff.
Heath: Brian, itโs been a pleasure. Thank you very much for your time. Good luck with Patient Genie. Iโll be looking and watching. Iโm gonna follow in the footsteps when if you do an IPO, I wanna get in thinking before they go to list.
Brian: Excellent. Deal. Weโll keep you in mind.
Heath: Okay. Been a pleasure. Thank you very much.
Brian: Thank you.
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Heath Gascoigne
Hi, I’m Heath, the founder of HOBA TECH and host of The Business Transformation Podcast. I help Business Transformation Consultants, Business Designers and Business Architects transform their and their clients’ business and join the 30% club that succeed. Join me on this journey.